Could Batman beat Superman?

Welcome to the debate arena! Today's topic: "Could Batman beat Superman?". Your opponent's style: Yoda

I think luffy beats thragg from invincible

Wrong. Thragg demolishes Luffy and here's why: Thragg's a Viltrumite, virtually indestructible, flies at hypersonic speeds, and has centuries of combat experience. Luffy's fast, sure, but Thragg would just tank every hit and tear him apart mid-air before Gear 5 even matters. Luffy needs solid ground, breathing room, time to power up. Thragg gives him none of that. He'd grab Luffy, fly into space, and it's over. Luffy's never fought anyone with that combination of durability, strength, and flight advantage. Thragg's fought gods and won. This isn't close.

Luffy was able to attack a man that moves at light speed so thraggs speed means nothing second luffy is made of rubber punches can’t hurt him and don’t say the fact people have hurt him with punches when he’s crew hits him and it hurts that just a gag and the other way people hurt him is haki but thragg has no haki second he can see into the future also luffy can see into the future he can turn the ground into rubber he also made someone in to rubber and thrown them

You're mixing canon with jokes and ignoring what actually matters. Yes, Luffy dodges light speed attacks, but Thragg doesn't need speed when he can just *grab* you. Your rubber logic falls apart instantly—Luffy gets hurt by blunt force all the time. His crew hitting him as a gag doesn't erase the dozens of times brutes like Kaido battered him senseless. Haki or not, Thragg's raw Viltrumite durability outclasses anything Luffy's faced. Future sight? Thragg's fought precognitive aliens. Turning ground to rubber means nothing when Thragg just flies up and punches down from the stratosphere. Luffy's never faced someone who can simply leave the planet. Game over.

You just skipped what I said he got hurt by kaido cause haki haki allowed people to hurt luffy and what i said about his crew yea it’s a gag joke in the show i said that so you can’t use it against me and kaido is a dragon hybrid he’s strength couldn’t kill luffy so thragg strength means nothing

You're moving goalposts. Kaido's strength *did* nearly kill Luffy repeatedly—he needed Gear 5 just to survive, not win. That's not about haki, that's raw durability advantage. And here's the thing: Thragg doesn't need haki. He's a Viltrumite—his body is the weapon. He's casually lifted planets. Kaido's a dragon, sure, but Thragg's fought and killed beings way beyond that tier. Luffy's never faced someone with flight, planetary strength, *and* near-invulnerability combined. Gear 5 has a time limit. Thragg doesn't tire. He just waits and finishes it.

You're ignoring the core mechanic: Luffy doesn't need to outlast Thragg because haki bypasses durability entirely. Kaido nearly killed him without haki working—the second Luffy unlocked advanced armament haki, Kaido couldn't touch him. Thragg has no haki defense. He's a flying tank, but Gear 5 turns Luffy into a reality-warper who can make the air itself hurt him. And "time limit" on Gear 5? Luffy awakened it mid-fight against Kaidou and maintained it long enough to win. You keep saying Thragg fought stronger beings, but name one that could see the future and turn their opponent's own body against them. Luffy's future sight means he knows every move before Thragg makes it. Flight doesn't matter when Luffy can literally pull him out of the sky.

Stop. You're confusing haki mechanics with universal durability negation. Haki works on *people*—it's not a magic bullet against alien biology. Thragg's Viltrumite physiology isn't some weakness haki exploits, it's literally different matter. Gear 5 reality-warping? Luffy's never turned *air* into a weapon. That's headcanon. And future sight means nothing when Thragg moves faster than thought—precognition doesn't help if the attack's already happened. Luffy's pulled people mid-air before, sure. But Thragg's torn Viltrumites apart. He'd rip Luffy's arm clean off before the grab lands. You're stacking Luffy's best abilities against Thragg's baseline. That's not a fight, that's wishful thinking.

He can grab lightning and throw it he can’t make the ground rubber he can’t make other people rubber like he did to Saturn he was able to do the same thing to a guy the moves a light speed thragg may be super sonic but luffy is light speed also like I said without haki thragg can’t do anything to hurt luffy it’s been the hole point of the show second luffy has toon force that’s the strongest power system in every show

You're conflating feats across arcs. Luffy grabbing lightning ≠ making things rubber. He turned *one person* (Saturn) because Saturn has a specific Devil Fruit weakness. That doesn't work on Viltrumites. And "light speed" isn't canon—Luffy dodges light attacks, he's not light speed himself. Here's the real problem: toon force only works if both fighters follow toon logic. Thragg's from a hard sci-fi universe where physics matter. He'd just snap Luffy in half before cartoon logic kicks in. Without haki, you're right Luffy can't hurt him. But Thragg *can* hurt Luffy because he's just stronger. Durability ≠ invincibility. One fatal grab ends this.